Domain Name Appraisal Scam
I have been experimenting recently with domain name sales and like every other domainer, hope someone is going to offer me a big wad of cash for a name which only cost me about £5 to register. Imagine my surprise, when out of the blue an email arrives in my inbox from a company called Elite Investment who wanted to do just that…
The domain name in question was for iphone21sales.com which I registered because the iPhone has recently updated its software to version 2.1. I thought I’d try my luck with it because it may appeal to someone who sells or promotes the products online.
This is the first email I received from Elite Investment:
Hello,
Your domain name has been found online.
Please let us know your price.
We make money on selling and buying names and sites. Now the domain business is very attractive.
Looking forward to do business with you.
Regards,
Paul Rancour
CEO
ELI LLC
I didn’t really think too much about it at this point because the domain was listed for sale on eBay, I believe it to be fairly relevant and (perhaps naively) assumed it was from a buyer who was interested in purchasing it outside of eBay. I replied:
Hi Paul,
Thanks for your inquiry.
That domain, along with the .net version and four others are available as a package on my eBay listing below:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=150293966033&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT&ih=005
Kind Regards,
David
What made me suspect this was a scam was when “Paul” replied, completely ignoring the fact my domain was listed on eBay and he would offer me $12,000 instead without any sort of negotiation. Did he think I was greedy, stupid, or a scammer-friendly combination of the two?
Can you accept 12,000 USD?
Do you sell domain with a web site or just the name?
Domain without content is ok with me. Web site is not necessary.
Have you had your domain names evaluated in the past? I mean domain appraisals. Without valuation we cannot be sure in the sale price. It’s very important for me in terms of reselling too. But we must engage a valuation company with REAL manual service. So I will only accept valuations from independent sources I and my partners trust.
To avoid mistakes I asked domain experts about reputable appraisal companies.
Please check this blog with suggestions from other sellers and buyers:
http://webtalk.007sites.com/Archive/425389.htmIf, for example, the valuation comes higher you can adjust your asking price accordingly. It will be fair. I also hope you can give me 12% - 15% discount.
After you send me the valuation via email (usually it takes 1-2 days to obtain it) we’ll continue our negotiations.
What is your preferred payment method: Escrow.com, International wire transfer, PayPal.com or something else?
Hope we can come to an agreement fast.
Looking forward to your reply.
He wanted me to have a look at a blog hosted on a free service for “recommendations” of domain appraisal services. This smacked of a con whereby I would be persuaded to spend money on an expensive appraisal service associated (unbeknown to me) with the scammer, only for him to disappear with my money as soon as the appraisal was returned.
Anyway, it was a bit of a slow day so I thought I’d have a bit of fun with him…
Hi,
I do not have the time to get the domain name “valued” because ultimately it is a waste of time.
As you know, a domain name is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it.
If you want to offer $12,000 with “discount”, I will happily accept $10,000.
A bank transfer would be the most convenient for me.
Let me know what you think.
Kind Regards,
David
My suspicions were confirmed when the scammer replied again, citing he was “prohibited” by “industry professionals” to proceed with any purchase without “manual valuation”. So, he is not allowed to make his own decisions?
Plus, he warned me “nobody would buy” my domain without such a service. Thank you for telling me how to run my business and the countless domain names being sold on eBay, Sitepoint and other forums without manual valuation must be some incredible hallucination.
The slimy character did not recommend using a specific service at this point but I expect he was lining that up for the next reply. However, I was getting bored by this and didn’t give him a chance to line one up for me with this response:
Hi,I don’t want to take additional risks either, so I’ll obtain a “professional appraisal” from a business contact of mine who deals with domain names for a living.
He will be able to provide me with an honest, professional appraisal free of charge within six hours maximum.
This will ensure I do not have to use a dubious and expensive service “recommended” by you due to the risk of it being a scam and run the risk of you disappearing as soon as the valuation has been decided and my money has been banked.
If you are happy to proceed with this and thus prove your intentions are legitimate, then please get back to me at your earliest convenience.
Unsurprisingly I didn’t hear anything back, thus indicating the company’s intentions were anything but legitimate.
Some further research revealed their company website looks like it was put together in 1999, complete with clipart image and not that of a company which throws around five and six figure sums on domain names.
A WHOIS search shows the domain name was only registered on 10 August, but they have paid a little extra to mask their identity, funny that.
It seems Elite Investment have been busy, with people discussing the scam here and here and this little beauty also shows they have dabbled in Forex Trading as well. Multi-talented these guys!
So, if anyone gets an email from this company, or similar, do the sensible thing and file it neatly in your Deleted Items folder!
Has anyone else heard from these clowns? If so, leave a comment below!
Just got the email today… don’t think...
Received the same email today.
I was excited for all of ten seconds as this is the first site I have made availble for purchase.
Gone with Sedo.
Checked google and found this page.
Saved me wasting my time
I have received the same e-mail. Let’s play. I love playing with these kinda guys…
Glad i found this page. Received a similar email
“Hello,
Your domain name has been found online.
Please let us know your price.
We make money on selling and buying names and sites. Now the domain
business is very attractive.
Looking forward to do business with you.
Regards,
Joshua Knight
Vice President
Norway Capital Investment Group”
Thanks for saving me time and money. I had my hopes up for about 3 or 4 minutes until I stumbled across this!
I received the same email just the other day. It is the same exact wordings. Right now he is waiting for my reply for his appraisal endorsement. I smelled a scam immediately. I researched eliteinvestment on the web, and sure enough it is a scam.
The scam operator should be put on the slammer.
Thank you so much for typing this out. I received the same email and I didn’t know what to do with.
I am just a Nemo in this business and I know there are many many big sharks out there.
Received a similar email this am after having listed several domain names on Sedo. Googled the company name (Elite investment) and found your blog. Won’t bother to take it any further but grateful for the warning. Many thanks!
THANK YOU for posting this! I just got this email for my domain http://www.Flawl3ss.com
Offer for flawl3ss.com (sent 10/14/2008)
…
“carter@eliteinvestment.net”
“carter@eliteinvestment.net”
Hello,
Your domain name has been found online.
Please let us know your price.
We make money on selling and buying names and sites. Now the domain
business is very attractive.
Looking forward to do business with you.
Regards,
Anthony Carter
Vice President
Elite Capital Investment Group
Thank God for google!!
These guys sent me the same message from Anthony at eliteinvestments.
Maybe I’ll play with them a bit and get there hopes up. lol
Rob
I got the same e-mail a few days ago. Didn’t seem right when I tried to get rid of them asking for 75,000 USD for my domain name and they didn’t even hesitate. Going on and on about their appraisal services…..like a bad joke.
This page was really helpful. Thanks. Keep posting about these kind of things. Good luck every one with your domain businesses!
Bloody hell what a waste of time, been through the process, had suspicions but the greed in me made me pursue this.. Cottoned on toward the end though, and replied accordingly.. felt a bit gutted i had though, so started researching, and found this thread. brilliant.. thanks
Hi,
Ok, I do not need a manual valuation, being involved in the web since its birth and working with it for years, I understand the true value of http://www.gloogle.biz, its $6,000.
Please proceed and have a manual valuation if this is what “YOU” require. I have no problem in deducting the costs from the final offer, but I hope the costs are minimal, as the valuation businesses are yours after all.
Kind regards, Damien
It’s a big risk to proceed without professional valuation. I already spoke to industry experts and they prohibited me to do business without valuation..
Without manual valuation nobody will buy. You’ll sit on your domain for years in this case, paying renewal fees to your registrar. Just think about it. So sooner or later, you’ll have to obtain an appraisal. Why waste time now?
As a seller, you can use a valuation certificate to sell names to other buyers. I cannot do the same because I don’t keep control over your domain.
I’m still interested in your domain. Hope you’ll change your position. I simply don’t want to take additional risks.
Thank you for understanding. I’m looking forward to do business with you.
—– Original Message —–
From: “Damien heaton”
To: “‘Crutcher’”
Sent: Saturday, November 15, 2008 12:11 AM
Subject: RE: Offer for gloogle.biz (sent 11/14/2008)
>I agree totally, welcoming your offer.
>
> Kind regards, Damien
>
> —–Original Message—–
> From: Crutcher [mailto:crutcher@eliteinvestment.net]
> Sent: 14 November 2008 20:57
> To: Damien heaton
> Subject: Re: Offer for gloogle.biz (sent 11/14/2008)
>
> It’s a standard practice to show independent valuation to
> buyers/resellers.
> Nobody will do business without it. I’m a businessman and have no
> intention
> of changing rules which help both parties to avoid additional risks.
>
> Of course, investors never take into account auto-generated vlauations. So
> manual valuation is a “must” too.
>
> I read the following information about appraisals at:
> http://webtalk.007sites.com/Archive/482751.htm
>
> Thank you for understanding. I’m looking forward to do business with you.
>
> —– Original Message —–
> From: “Damien heaton”
> To: “‘Crutcher’”
> Sent: Friday, November 14, 2008 10:16 PM
> Subject: RE: Offer for gloogle.biz (sent 11/14/2008)
>
>
>> Many thanks for your email.
>>
>> The price included the website and the marketing concept. You are one of
>> a
>> few bidders, it’s the first serious offer I will take.
>>
>> Please advise.
>>
>> Kind regards,
>>
>> Damien Heaton
>> Gloogle.biz
>>
>>
>> —–Original Message—–
>> From: Crutcher [mailto:crutcher@eliteinvestment.net]
>> Sent: 14 November 2008 18:59
>> To: Damien Heaton
>> Subject: Re: Offer for gloogle.biz (sent 11/14/2008)
>>
>> 6000. Ok.
>>
>> Do you sell domain with a web site or just the name?
>>
>> Domain without content is ok with me. Web site is not necessary.
>>
>> Have you had your domain names evaluated in the past? I mean domain
>> appraisals. Without valuation we cannot be sure in the sale price. It’s
>> very
>>
>> important for me in terms of reselling too. But we must engage a
>> valuation
>> company with REAL manual service. So I will only accept valuations from
>> independent sources I and my partners trust.
>>
>> To avoid mistakes I asked domain experts about reputable appraisal
>> companies.
>>
>> Please check this blog with suggestions from other sellers and buyers:
>> http://webtalk.007sites.com/Archive/482751.htm
>>
>> If, for example, the valuation comes higher you can adjust your asking
>> price
>>
>> accordingly. It will be fair. I also hope you can give me 12% - 15%
>> discount.
>>
>> After you send me the valuation via email (usually it takes 1-2 days to
>> obtain it) we’ll continue our negotiations.
>>
>> What is your preferred payment method: Escrow.com, International wire
>> transfer, PayPal.com or something else?
>>
>> Hope we can come to an agreement fast.
>>
>> Looking forward to your reply.
>> —– Original Message —–
>> From: “Damien Heaton”
>> To:
>> Sent: Friday, November 14, 2008 4:34 PM
>> Subject: Re: Offer for gloogle.biz (sent 11/14/2008)
>>
>>
>> Hi
>>
>> I have got a price of $10,000 US, but a reserve of $6,000. So I guess
>> an offer around this range would be acceptable.
>>
>> Kind regards,
>>
>> Damien Heaton
>> gloogle.biz
>>
>>
>> ——– Original Message ——–
>>
>> ==> From:
>> ==> Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2008 05:16:43 -0700
>>
>> Hello,
>>
>> Your domain name has been found online. Please let us know your
>> price.
>>
>> We are always interested in buying and selling good domains.
>>
>> Looking forward to do business with you.
>>
>> Regards, Gary Crutcher Vice President Elite Network
Damn,
Was excited there until I read these posts
Just got the email today… don’t think I’ll reply… can’t be bothered with morons who try to rip people off. Thanks everyone for the warnings
I had the identical experience within the last few days from Elite Network for one of my domain names: Lingerie.biz. (and now that I see gloogle.biz is worth $6k I probably should get a more recent appraisal for lingerie.biz).
I copy and pasted a paragraph from one of too many replies from Elite Network and Bingo! I find this page!
Thank you. What happens when I get a legitimate offer? How will I know.
I am generally cautious and treat all unknown authors as potential scammers, but they engaged me in the same way and I bit into the scam too. At first glance, I assumed he was trying to sell appraisal services. His “independent” link was a bit convincing. Just when I allowed myself a few seconds to let it sink in that it could be my luck to get such a nice offer…I did what that little nagging voice said and did a Google check on the email and name. I am so glad you discussed this!
What gets me is that I got personal and discussed my situation and why I was selling my site… and this scammer has no problem taking advantage of me. I removed the details of my situation for privacy purposes.
Here’s my discussion with Mr. Gary Crutcher:
Can you accept 5,000 USD?
Do you sell domain with a web site or just the name?
Domain without content is ok with me. Web site is not necessary.
Have you had your domain names evaluated in the past? I mean domain appraisals. Without valuation we cannot be sure in the sale price. It’s very important for me in terms of reselling too. But we must engage a valuation company with REAL manual service. So I will only accept valuations from independent sources I and my partners trust.
To avoid mistakes I asked domain experts about reputable appraisal companies.
Please check this blog with suggestions from other sellers and buyers:
http://webtalk.007sites.com/Archive/482751.htm
If, for example, the valuation comes higher you can adjust your asking price accordingly. It will be fair. I also hope you can give me 12% - 15% discount.
After you send me the valuation via email (usually it takes 1-2 days to obtain it) we’ll continue our negotiations.
What is your preferred payment method: Escrow.com, International wire transfer, PayPal.com or something else?
Hope we can come to an agreement fast.
Looking forward to your reply.
—– Original Message —–
From: “Torrey”
To: “‘Crutcher’”
Sent: Sunday, November 23, 2008 6:37 PM
Subject: RE: tailoredmaid.com (sent 11/22/2008)
> Mr. Crutcher,
>
> Thank you for your continued response and information. I admit, I am new
> to
> the concept of selling domains and did not realize the added value of
> having
> the domain appraised. I do appreciate the guidance.
>
> I am marketing the site as both the domain and web content. I used MS
> Office Live as the host, which is proprietary in the use of the site.
> However, Melbourne IT is the registrar. MS Office Live has indicated that
> if anyone buys the site and needs to use the web content outside of their
> proprietary hosting, the code can be copied and used by another hosting
> service if they choose not to transfer the site internally. I feel the
> web
> content is a value-added benefit to the domain. If you choose to use it,
> that’s fine. I am including the custom graphics and logos to the
> potential
> buyer and releasing all rights to the new owner. If a buyer only wishes
> to
> buy the domain, that’s fine too.
>
>
> I would need some time to come up with the funds to get a manual
> appraisal.
> This will delay any negotiations, but your honesty with me to base the
> sale
> on the true value of the domain is admirable. (personal discussion removed)
>
> I put a lot of effort in the name “Tailored Maid” and generate a lot of
> interest in the site. I know that with some patience, I will find the
> right
> buyer. Hopefully we can be of benefit to each other.
>
> I recently registered with Escrow.com and feel this is the best method of
> transfer if we reach that point.
>
> Thanks again for your time. I will continue my efforts to get a manual
> appraisal. In the meantime, the offer still stands.
>
> Sincerely,
> Torrey
>
>
>
> —–Original Message—–
> From: Crutcher [mailto:crutcher@eliteinvestment.net]
> Sent: Sunday, November 23, 2008 12:46 AM
> To: Torrey
> Subject: Re: tailoredmaid.com (sent 11/22/2008)
>
> 1500. Ok.
>
> Do you sell domain with a web site or just the name?
>
> Domain without content is ok with me. Web site is not necessary.
>
> Have you had your domain names evaluated in the past? I mean domain
> appraisals. Without valuation we cannot be sure in the sale price. It’s
> very
>
> important for me in terms of reselling too. But we must engage a valuation
> company with REAL manual service. So I will only accept valuations from
> independent sources I and my partners trust.
>
> To avoid mistakes I asked domain experts about reputable appraisal
> companies.
>
> Please check this blog with suggestions from other sellers and buyers:
> http://webtalk.007sites.com/Archive/482751.htm
>
> If, for example, the valuation comes higher you can adjust your asking
> price
>
> accordingly. It will be fair. I also hope you can give me 12% - 15%
> discount.
>
> After you send me the valuation via email (usually it takes 1-2 days to
> obtain it) we’ll continue our negotiations.
>
> What is your preferred payment method: Escrow.com, International wire
> transfer, PayPal.com or something else?
>
> Hope we can come to an agreement fast.
>
> Looking forward to your reply.
> —– Original Message —–
> From: “Torrey”
> To:
> Sent: Saturday, November 22, 2008 11:30 PM
> Subject: RE: tailoredmaid.com (sent 11/22/2008)
>
>
>> Mr. Crutcher,
>>
>> Thank you for your interest. The domain and website content are
>> available
>> for $1,500.00 USD. Please let me know if you have continued interest and
>> if
>> I can answer any questions you may have.
>>
>> Sincerely,
>> Torrey
>> http://www.tailoredmaid.com
>>
>>
>> —–Original Message—–
>> From: crutcher@eliteinvestment.net [mailto:crutcher@eliteinvestment.net]
>> Sent: Saturday, November 22, 2008 8:35 AM
>> To: removed@tailoredmaid.com
>> Subject: tailoredmaid.com (sent 11/22/2008)
>>
>> Hello,
>>
>> Your domain name has been found online. Please let us know your price.
>>
>> We are always interested in buying and selling good domains.
>>
>> Looking forward to do business with you.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Gary Crutcher
>> Vice President
>> Elite Network
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